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Episode 94

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Published on:

22nd May 2023

Eating In Season, Our One-Minute Cooking Tip, An Interview With Nevada Berg, Pork Rinds, Vindaloo & More!

Seasonality. We're talking about in this podcast episode.

Everybody talks about eating in season. But what does that really mean? And what happens when you live in a place without all the seasons? Or like us, in a place where winter lasts for six months?

Welcome to our food and cooking podcast. We're veteran cookbook authors Bruce Weinstein & Mark Scarbrough. We've written and published over three dozen cookbooks and been contributing editors to COOKING LIGHT and EATING WELL. Check out one of our favorite cookbooks, THE KITCHEN SHORTCUT BIBLE.

After we talk about eating in (and out of) season, we've got a one-minute cooking tip about shrimp. Then Bruce interviews Nevada Berg about her book NORWEGIAN BAKING THROUGH THE SEASONS. And we tell you what's making us happy in food this week.

Thanks for taking the time to be with us. Here are the segments of this episode of COOKING WITH BRUCE & MARK:

[00:59] Eating and cooking out of season

[12:25] Our one-minute cooking tip: the benefits of frozen shrimp.

[14:03] Bruce's interview with Nevada Berg, author of NORWEGIAN BAKING THROUGH THE SEASONS.

[31:05] What’s making us happy in food this week? Pork rinds and vindaloo!

Transcript
Bruce:

Hey, I'm Bruce Weinstein and this is the Podcast Cooking with Bruce Martin.

Mark:

And I'm Mark Scarborough.

Mark:

And together with Bruce, we have written three dozen cookbooks,

Mark:

including the latest, the Look and Cook Air Fryer Bible out this fall.

Mark:

I cannot wait.

Mark:

It has 125 Great, easy recipes for.

Mark:

Air frying boat More than that, it has, as you know, if you listen

Mark:

to this podcast, 704 photographs, every single step of every recipe

Mark:

photographed unbelievable effort.

Mark:

Herculean.

Mark:

Ooh, there's a word for you.

Mark:

Yeah, Herculean effort Boat.

Mark:

We're not gonna talk about air frying in this episode of our podcast.

Mark:

Instead, we're gonna be talking about cooking in and out of season.

Mark:

We've got a one minute cooking tip.

Mark:

Bruce has an interview with Nevada Berg.

Mark:

The author of the new book, Norwegian, baking Through the Seasons,

Mark:

and we'll be telling you what's making us happy in food this week.

Mark:

So let's get started.

Bruce:

It is coming into summer.

Bruce:

It's summer for some of you already, but where are we?

Bruce:

Hello?

Mark:

We're recording this on a night when it's gonna be going down below 32,

Mark:

below freezing, 32 Fahrenheit tonight.

Mark:

We're actually gonna have a freeze tonight in New England, so there you are.

Bruce:

It is early spring here, even though we're having a freeze.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

And we, mark and I are still relying on out of season supermarket

Bruce:

produce and we have to rely on that for a few more weeks and, yep.

Bruce:

You know, it's discouraging, but you do what you gotta do and if you want to cook,

Bruce:

you gotta do out of season sometimes.

Bruce:

But we wanna talk about ways to cook and shop out of season that might

Bruce:

make it a little better and tastier.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

In our part of New England, we don't even have asparagus yet.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

We have ramps are just coming in and going out.

Mark:

If you dunno what that is, you don't live in our part of the world.

Mark:

It's kind of an obsession up here and an obsession that I can actually skip.

Mark:

But that's to it.

Mark:

Either another podcast, really.

Mark:

Not entirely into ramps, but yeah, I'm not either.

Mark:

But uh, that's a, a whole matter that we can talk about.

Mark:

That's another time.

Mark:

That's true.

Mark:

So anyway, we wanna talk about what's kind of decent and not deceit.

Mark:

Now let's start with the big one.

Mark:

And this is a big one across.

Mark:

Uh, so much of Europe and North America, and that is tomatoes.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

And it's a big one because, uh, well, you know, tomatoes are kind

Mark:

of mely when they're not in season.

Mark:

There is a, uh, cheese shop and man sandwich counter near us and they actually

Mark:

at one point kind of had a sign that said, don't even dare order A B L T

Mark:

before August, which just cracks me out.

Mark:

So they wouldn't serve anything until the tomatoes were.

Mark:

In in New England and it is hard to find a good tomato that's worth eating.

Mark:

I don't know, in the winter, fall, spring, it's hard to find them.

Bruce:

Your best bet if you want to be eating tomatoes when they're

Bruce:

not grown fresh, where you are, is to go with cherry tomatoes.

Bruce:

They tend to be sweeter.

Bruce:

They tend to always be good no matter what time of year you get them.

Bruce:

Right, right.

Bruce:

But avoid the hot house tomatoes.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

In the winter, because they're just gonna be, as Mark said,

Bruce:

mealy or they're gonna be hard.

Bruce:

They're gonna be tasteless.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

But what do you do for cooking?

Mark:

Well, um, canned can work.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

Now, I have to say that I made a very classic regu a few weeks

Mark:

ago, and I did use the Roman tomatoes and they were mely, but.

Mark:

I want to confess that this ragu simmered on top of the stove for six hours.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

So that mes was, was long gone by the time that Ragu got to the table.

Bruce:

But canned is always a good option in the winter because

Bruce:

canned tomatoes, especially if they come from Italy, they're packed.

Bruce:

These good Marzano Italian tomatoes are.

Bruce:

Delicious.

Bruce:

They're packed at their peak of ripeness.

Bruce:

And even California tomatoes that are canned are canned

Bruce:

at their peak of ripeness.

Bruce:

And whether you get the whole ones, the diced up, the pure, the

Bruce:

chopped, they are a good alternative for cooking throughout the year.

Mark:

Yeah, and don't, let's just say don't be fooled by heirloom tomatoes

Mark:

out of season in your supermarket.

Mark:

These can be just as mely as the worst tomatoes out there.

Mark:

And also, don't be fooled by the tomatoes that sit.

Mark:

On the vine in the supermarket.

Mark:

That's a really clever marketing technique, but many of those

Mark:

are also picked green and are essentially ripened in transport.

Mark:

So don't necessarily hold onto that.

Mark:

The vine means something, a big battle in our house with.

Mark:

Uh, cooking in and out of season or eating in and out of season has to do with

Mark:

melons, and this, I will confess, is me.

Mark:

I won't if you're the one battling, I won't eat a watermelon unless

Mark:

it is from a local farmer's market and ripe in the summer.

Mark:

And I'm very, very, the same way about Cantal, LOEs, and honey juice's.

Mark:

Bruce is much more forgiving melons than I am.

Bruce:

Love melons.

Bruce:

Melons or something that I can't live without.

Bruce:

And as soon as they come into season in Florida, which is now, they ship

Bruce:

'em up here and I start devouring them.

Bruce:

And yes, I will switch over to local melons in August and I will have to give

Bruce:

up melons by, you know, end of October and have to wait again until the spring.

Bruce:

Because the melons even in the winter are just, if they

Bruce:

come in from the tropics Yes.

Bruce:

Or they come in from South America.

Bruce:

Yes.

Bruce:

I also have an ethical problem eating a piece of fruit that's been

Bruce:

flown 5,000 miles to get to me.

Bruce:

Flown, shipped.

Bruce:

Oh, shipped 5,000.

Bruce:

Oh, yeah, well, whatever.

Bruce:

It's not, it's, I have an ethical issue with that and there never

Bruce:

is good because you can't.

Bruce:

Grow them till they're sweet enough at that, you know, shipping it that

Mark:

far.

Mark:

I would also say that if you're interested in eating in and outta

Mark:

season, you basically, unless you're gonna cook with it, you should

Mark:

skip all so-called stone fruits.

Mark:

That peaches and plums and apricots.

Mark:

Skip those things out of season unless you're cooking with them.

Mark:

Now listen, I have made use frozen, right?

Mark:

Right.

Mark:

You can use frozen and remember many.

Mark:

Vegetables and fruits like peaches are picked closer to ripeness to

Mark:

be frozen than they're picked to be shipped fresh to the store.

Mark:

So that means that they're often tastier when frozen.

Mark:

Although again, the texture is compromised by the freezing and thawing process.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

There's just no way you're going to get a decent plum or a peach or a cherry in the,

Bruce:

in North America in the middle of January.

Bruce:

It's not gonna happen.

Bruce:

No.

Mark:

Well, no.

Mark:

Not that I've ever saved.

Bruce:

So you go with frozen and then you make yourself a nice crisp, or

Bruce:

you make muffins or you make something like that, and then we get to berries.

Bruce:

Now berries are something that tend to grow year round in California and in

Bruce:

the southern states, so you can get.

Bruce:

Decent blueberries and raspberries year round.

Bruce:

You can, I would avoid strawberries then.

Mark:

Um, I, I'm a big blueberry eater.

Mark:

I, I have blueberries almost every morning with a piece of cheese for my breakfast.

Mark:

And, uh, I can see that the blueberry varietals have changed over the

Mark:

years and they've gotten incredibly sweeter and also incredibly bigger.

Mark:

I mean, the, they're like cherry tomatoes, hamming fruit.

Mark:

I know.

Mark:

It's becoming like a hand fruit for each blueberry.

Mark:

They're getting so big.

Mark:

These varietals are.

Mark:

Bread to last to be sweet, to sit on a store shelf for a long time.

Mark:

It is Bruce is right, raspberries, blueberries and

Mark:

blackberries are better choices.

Mark:

And let me give you a little tip about how to pick them because

Mark:

you know they mold within a second of getting them home shoes.

Mark:

Okay?

Mark:

Here's what you wanna do when you're in the supermarket.

Mark:

You know they have that little piece of paper, that absorbent

Mark:

piece of paper at the bottom of the container, usually, okay?

Mark:

When you pick up the container, turn it upside down.

Mark:

If any of the berries stick to that piece of paper, put it back down.

Mark:

Mm, good.

Mark:

Good tip.

Mark:

They should all fall down toward now the top, which is turned

Mark:

upside down of the container.

Mark:

Once they're sticking to that, they're starting to leak moisture.

Mark:

And that moisture is what will cause mold D and within a second of your buying them.

Bruce:

And that is, that is so disheartening.

Bruce:

You spend $4 for a small container of berries in the winter and you get them

Bruce:

home and the next day you open them and they're already moldy and it's.

Bruce:

Some stores will actually give you your money back.

Bruce:

But you know, you have to be comfortable going in and saying, I want my money back.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

I, I have the, I have a sim, a similar reaction to apples.

Mark:

I just can't eat an apple except in the fall, and that's partly

Mark:

because I live in New England and the apples all come in and, yes.

Mark:

Can I bake with apples?

Mark:

Can I cook with us?

Mark:

How I put apples in, let's say cornbread, stuffing?

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

At Thanksgiving, of course you can bake and cook with apples out of season.

Mark:

And the modern hybridized fruit is made for cooking outta season.

Mark:

But, Eating, as we say in the south out of the hand.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

Eating out of the hand is not necessarily the right way to take

Mark:

an apple, at least in my opinion, until they're truly in season.

Mark:

One of the longest seasons of any fruit or vegetable out there anymore is citrus.

Bruce:

I know.

Bruce:

It used to be so limited.

Bruce:

It didn't start until January, maybe around Christmas.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

And it was done by February.

Bruce:

But global warming is changing that.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

And farming is happening more, and citrus is growing longer.

Bruce:

It's starting.

Bruce:

Earlier.

Bruce:

It's going longer.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

You can get good citrus now, sometimes in early autumn, and you can get

Bruce:

it all the way through spring and so I get my delicious sumo oranges.

Bruce:

I get my little cuties, my clementines, my California naval.

Bruce:

I can get them for a long time, which is really nice.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Well, uh, it will be intriguing to see what happens to some of this stuff as

Mark:

more and more where they're growing these under lights in giant warehouses.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

And I've seen now many a video of growing, let's say broccoli, and they

Mark:

have it stacked up 10, 12, 14 racks high.

Mark:

Wow.

Mark:

And then they're growing it.

Mark:

Under ultraviolet lights and various kinds of lighting.

Mark:

Are you using dirt or is it hydroponic?

Mark:

No, it's in a hydroponic kind of environment, but they're, they

Mark:

feed it soil nutrients that way.

Mark:

It's all very intriguing and they're actually trying to get.

Mark:

Organic certification and I actually saw recently someone who was trying

Mark:

to work out a startup of growing citrus this way in which the trees

Mark:

are miniaturized, lemon and tangerine trees, and yet they'd have like five

Mark:

and six stacked high rows of them.

Mark:

It'll be intriguing to see what will happen with that kind of agriculture.

Bruce:

Well, I think you're gonna start with your $10 lemon.

Bruce:

I think that's perhaps probably how it's gonna start, but it would be intriguing.

Bruce:

Of course, you can get bananas year round.

Bruce:

They grow in the tropics do They don't grow in backyards in the suburbs.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

You haven't been to southern Texas, but go ahead.

Bruce:

Do they grow bananas?

Bruce:

Yes.

Bruce:

Go ahead.

Bruce:

That's impressive.

Bruce:

Go on.

Bruce:

And you can get.

Bruce:

Pineapples cuz they're grown year round in Hawaii and other tropical places and

Bruce:

that's really nice that you can get those.

Bruce:

But I gotta tell you, by March I'm so sick of bananas and pineapples

Bruce:

and I start craving others of grape.

Bruce:

Now grapes you can get year round and they're usually pretty good.

Bruce:

And I'm actually okay with grapes because I love grapes.

Mark:

Yeah, well it is that time of year in New England when we have

Mark:

watched the days change, the light is changing, the ice are much longer

Mark:

now our daylight is much longer.

Mark:

Because we're so far north, we're really starting to get into the long bright.

Mark:

Eight days, but of course we still don't have any local fruits or vegetables.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

And it all seems very cruel.

Mark:

What we're left with are those berries, remember turn those

Mark:

containers subs upside again.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

Bananas, which.

Mark:

You know, I mean, how many can you do?

Bruce:

I got my Florida watermelons though.

Bruce:

Yay.

Mark:

Lots of, lots of lettuces and that kind of thing.

Mark:

And Cherry tomatoes, we, it's a cruel time of year for us because we are all

Mark:

dying for spring and summer crops to start coming yet, and they're just not here yet.

Mark:

Strawberries are still about a month away from us, so it's,

Mark:

it's still happening around us.

Mark:

This is all important thinking how to.

Mark:

Eat in and out of season because of the interview coming up with Nevada

Mark:

Berg that Bruce is going to do on Norwegian baking through the seasons.

Mark:

But before we get to any of the rest of this podcast, let me say that it

Mark:

would be great if you could subscribe, Ray, do those things to this podcast.

Mark:

If you subscribe, you won't miss an episode.

Mark:

It'll always drop into your feed, and if you rate it, that would

Mark:

be fantastic because we are an.

Mark:

Unsupported podcast and the only support you can give us is not only

Mark:

listening to us, but somehow writing a comment saying Great podcast, as

Mark:

somebody just recently just dropped a comment that just said, great podcast.

Mark:

You can't believe how appreciative we are of that and how much that does for

Mark:

the algorithm up next as he is typical.

Mark:

Our one minute cooking tip,

Bruce:

buy frozen shrimp.

Bruce:

That's really, really so easy.

Bruce:

Those three words will change your seafood eating.

Bruce:

It is because 99.99% of all shrimp comes out of the water and is frozen.

Bruce:

Correct.

Bruce:

So when you buy it at the fish counter, at your supermarket, or

Bruce:

even at the fish store or at Whole Foods or wherever you're shopping.

Bruce:

Correct.

Bruce:

It has been frozen and they.

Bruce:

Thought it correct.

Bruce:

Now, do you know when they thought it?

Bruce:

No.

Bruce:

It could have been this morning.

Bruce:

It could have been yesterday.

Bruce:

It could have been two days ago.

Bruce:

Yep.

Bruce:

If you buy the frozen shrimp, sometimes it's actually even a little cheaper.

Bruce:

Thought yourself at thaws in minutes in a bowl under running cool water.

Mark:

It, it used to be the truth in the United States.

Mark:

I believe the laws have now changed.

Mark:

It used to be the truth in the United States that you could not sell.

Mark:

Fresh shrimp, it had to have been frozen at harvest, and there were

Mark:

of course trucks along the Gulf Co coast that flouted these laws.

Mark:

I believe the laws have since changed, but it is still very hard to find

Mark:

fresh shrimp in the United States.

Bruce:

So why pay the store for having thought it for you and be

Bruce:

uncertain for how long it's been thaw?

Mark:

Yep.

Mark:

That's exactly right, and you can simply take those shrimp out,

Mark:

put them in a calendar and run cold water over them for what

Bruce:

five minutes is often enough.

Bruce:

Let them sit in cold water in a bowl and drain them in a

Bruce:

calendar they thought so fast.

Bruce:

There's no point in not keeping frozen shrimp in your freezer at all times.

Mark:

Up next Bruce's interview with Nevada Burg.

Mark:

She is the author of the brand new book, Norwegian Baking Through the

Mark:

Seasons, and Bruce spoke to her while she was indeed in Norway.

Bruce:

Today I'm really excited to be speaking with Nevada Burg.

Bruce:

She is originally from the American West and she now lives in Norway and

Bruce:

is the creator of the Norwegian Food and Culture website North wild Kitchen.

Bruce:

Her latest cookbook is just out.

Bruce:

It's absolutely beautiful, fabulous recipes.

Bruce:

It's called Norwegian Baking Through the Seasons.

Bruce:

Hey, Nevada, welcome.

Bruce:

Hi.

Bruce:

Thanks for having me.

Bruce:

My pleasure.

Bruce:

Your book is stunning.

Bruce:

It's filled with buns and cakes, flat breads, and crusty rolls, tarts and

Bruce:

pastries, and there is something about each and every bake in the book that

Bruce:

seems quintessentially Norwegian.

Bruce:

So I wanna start with that.

Bruce:

You divide your recipes up into seasons.

Bruce:

Can you tell me how the seasons influence Norwegian baking throughout the year?

Nevada:

Oh, most certainly.

Nevada:

Well, the way I've divided it up is actually into five seasons, even though

Nevada:

there's really only four, as we know, but it's to kind of follow the way the light

Nevada:

is in Norway because we have a very long winter season and it's, we have this thing

Nevada:

called meite, which is the dark time, and that goes all the way up to the winter

Nevada:

equinox when then it transitions over to, oh, now the days are getting lighter.

Nevada:

But we're still in this winter kind of thing, so I kind of broke those two up.

Nevada:

If you know much about Norway, everything is very much based

Nevada:

on relationship to nature.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And therefore the way the seasons kind of run, what ingredients are

Nevada:

in season, and also the holidays and the celebration times and, and the

Nevada:

way, you know, the winters often.

Nevada:

It's the preservation and it's kind of the hardier baked goods.

Nevada:

But then as we kind of come into spring, you get this kind of, all these, um, you

Nevada:

know, we have Easter's really big here.

Nevada:

So you have these more indulgent cakes and then you end up with the wild

Nevada:

edibles that are starting to pop up.

Nevada:

And then in the summer we have the midnight sun.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

So it's so bright and lovely.

Nevada:

And we get all these fresh berries and all the produce and everything's just

Nevada:

kind of popping and, and then you go into the more, you know, the autumn

Nevada:

season when it sees apples and, and root vegetables and all those things.

Nevada:

And then of course the winter kind of ends with.

Nevada:

The winter holidays with all the baked goods and indulgence there.

Nevada:

So I think the connection to nature is in is so imperative, it's so important

Nevada:

into the culture anyway, just by the way of life and always being outdoors.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And I think that the way they eat in the food culture is,

Nevada:

follows that exact same pattern.

Nevada:

Yeah.

Bruce:

The first part of your book, you offer up recipes for einkorn and honey

Bruce:

rolls and rustic einkorn and herb bread.

Bruce:

What's einkorn?

Bruce:

And if we can't find it here in the US what's a good substitute?

Nevada:

Well, it's an ancient grain and it's got these really lovely,

Nevada:

kind of complex, nutty notes to it.

Nevada:

It's much higher in, um, antioxidants than maybe in the more modern

Nevada:

varieties that we have here.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And it's, but it's unique in that it has, it's weaker and gluten.

Nevada:

It doesn't absorb as much liquid.

Nevada:

So in that case, when you're looking for a substitute, I would probably

Nevada:

recommend perhaps a whole wheat flour or a, a spelt, but then I would adjust

Nevada:

the liquid a little bit less, start with less, and then just kind of play with it.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And you know, I think with these ancient grains, and we have barley and Ry are

Nevada:

some of the most important grains that has been, uh, historically in Norway.

Nevada:

But we have so many producers now bringing them back, so that's adding

Nevada:

more and more back into our culture.

Nevada:

But I do know in the States there is a possibility you can

Nevada:

find them online now as well.

Nevada:

So just be sure to take a look out.

Bruce:

While you have a number of recipes for flat breads and

Bruce:

crackers, you offer up a recipe for barley and sea salt bread that.

Bruce:

Right in the photo.

Bruce:

Looks like a Norwegian version of focaccia.

Bruce:

It's a dimpled airy bread.

Bruce:

How important is the salt you use in this recipe?

Nevada:

The dough itself, it's kind, it's a barley base, but every single

Nevada:

bite is gonna have that lovely like, you know, punch of saltiness.

Nevada:

So you wanna have something that has this beautiful texture.

Nevada:

That just kind of melts in your mouth, but also gives you that like,

Nevada:

punch of salt without being bitter.

Nevada:

You know, I, I have a dear friend who produces salt in Norway, out on the

Nevada:

coast in a small island, and all my kind of salt recipes are inspired from her.

Nevada:

It reminds me of my time being there and watching her produce this from, you

Nevada:

know, the Norwegian Sea and just the technique and the art that goes into it.

Nevada:

I'm not a salt expert by any means, but I appreciate the

Nevada:

form, the art form that it is.

Nevada:

And I think that if you're gonna have something, just make sure, you know,

Nevada:

it's good quality, it tastes really good, and it just kind of melts in

Nevada:

your mouth, you know, you don't want anything too crunchy where you, I

Nevada:

have had some breads where you kind of crunch into it and it's just really

Nevada:

crystallized salts and it's a bit too much, you know, you want it to be there.

Nevada:

But then kind of melts away at the same time

Bruce:

When it comes to sweet recipes, yours seem elegant, yet

Bruce:

simple like your cinnamon cake bread.

Bruce:

Tell me about this recipe and why you love it so much.

Nevada:

Okay, so I was at the school event for my son and on the cake table, which

Nevada:

is a big thing here, where it was tons of different sheet cakes, and the one that

Nevada:

caught my eye was this very simple vanilla cake with like cinnamon sugar on top.

Nevada:

And I tried it and I thought, wow, this is so good.

Nevada:

It's so understated, but it's amazing.

Nevada:

And found out it was this canal kaka, which is cinnamon cake.

Nevada:

And I thought, okay, well I wanna make that.

Nevada:

But I thought, you know what?

Nevada:

I'll do it in a little bit of a different form.

Nevada:

We'll do it in a loaf tin instead.

Nevada:

And because that cinnamon sugar is so nice on top, I thought, let's try and

Nevada:

swirl it in the center too, so you get a little bit more prominence in each bite.

Nevada:

But what's so nice about it is that the top of it, you just get this

Nevada:

beautiful, like simple cinnamon sugar, and when it bakes, it gets that crust.

Nevada:

That kind of like cracks a little bit.

Nevada:

And so you get soft and moist crack, great texture, but it's so simple and

Nevada:

I love what you said about it kind of representing the baked goods, and

Nevada:

I think that's very much Norwegian baked goods, is this idea of you

Nevada:

don't need a lot of ingredients.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

You just have these really delicious flavors.

Nevada:

It's really simple, easy to make, but it just.

Nevada:

Stays with you the whole time.

Bruce:

Uh, Nevada, what's a Bergen pretzel and how does it differ from the crunchy

Bruce:

bags of pretzels we buy here in the

Nevada:

States, it's a von Krla, which means water pretzel, and it's

Nevada:

because it's, it's the B pretzel dough that's then put into a hot

Nevada:

water bath, and then it's baked.

Nevada:

Kind of the similar process.

Nevada:

It's probably different.

Nevada:

The fact that it fits in your palm of your hand.

Nevada:

It's not super crunchy like the little snack ones in the States,

Nevada:

but it's kind of an in between.

Nevada:

And the history of it, which is really fascinating, is that it, it was a.

Nevada:

Influenced by these Dutch and German salesmen that would come

Nevada:

during the Hon period in Bergen.

Nevada:

And Bergen is a wharf city.

Nevada:

So the fishermen needed something to take along their journeys, and

Nevada:

they needed something that would store easily last a long time.

Nevada:

And so they had these lovely little hard pretzels that could, you

Nevada:

know, have wonderful long shelf life and they could serve it.

Nevada:

And so to this day, um, it's tradition now to serve it during 17th of May,

Nevada:

which is Norway's Constitution Day.

Nevada:

And you serve it with cured meats.

Nevada:

And sour cream porridge.

Nevada:

But in, in my recipe, you get this more of a, you know, the crunchy

Nevada:

kind of outside, but then it's a little bit softer on the inside.

Nevada:

But if you cook it longer, you can get that, that hardy texture as well.

Bruce:

I have to ask, what is sour cream porridge?

Nevada:

Oh, it's, it's one of Norway's very, very traditional dishes.

Nevada:

You take full fat sour cream.

Nevada:

I mean, this is, this is a summer dish.

Nevada:

This is what would've been made on the summer farms in Norway

Nevada:

with the ladies working the cows.

Nevada:

They took that fresh cream.

Nevada:

Fresh milk and once you soured it, you would, you'd basically cook

Nevada:

it with flour and you just cook it down to where it separates the fat.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And it puts like, which is butter, essentially.

Nevada:

And the butter comes up the top and then you kind of spoon off the butter, put

Nevada:

it to the side, and then you, you know, so it thickens into this kind of thick

Nevada:

or, but when you have it from the farm, It's not that tangy, sour, sour cream

Nevada:

that you might get in the grocery store.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

So you need this full, fat, beautiful, smooth.

Nevada:

And then you, so it's kind of this beautiful bowl, pored, white porridge.

Nevada:

And then you bring that butter back that you had, pour it on top, more

Nevada:

cinnamon and sugar, and then you have this bowl of very deluxe, uh, porridge.

Bruce:

You can't include a recipe in your book that you're calling

Bruce:

the world's best cake and not now.

Bruce:

Explain why is it the best?

Nevada:

Well, it certainly lives up to its name.

Nevada:

It's actually also.

Nevada:

Known Asj Kaka.

Nevada:

And that's because it comes from that region.

Nevada:

Okay.

Nevada:

It's credited to a lady, uh, named Hoda, and she had a cafe in the 1930s.

Nevada:

So she bought the recipe from a Danish pastry, uh, chef.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

Brought us Norway, made it kind of tweaked, it made her

Nevada:

her own and it just blossomed.

Nevada:

She was very successful.

Nevada:

And it's just stayed around.

Nevada:

And to describe it, it's a very thin sponge cake with a meringue

Nevada:

topping, and they're baked together with almonds on top.

Nevada:

Once it's baked, you divide it in half.

Nevada:

You make a filling of custard and whipped cream.

Nevada:

And then that goes in there, and then you put the top back on.

Nevada:

So you get these, like all these lovely textures, the sponge cake, the sweetness

Nevada:

of the meringue, and then you get these like, oh yeah, all that custard

Nevada:

and ooey greenness that's coming out.

Nevada:

It's one of those cakes that's always the best the day after.

Nevada:

So it has the time to soak up the flavors.

Nevada:

And delightful with fresh fruits.

Nevada:

So strawberries and raspberries, and it's just, I don't know.

Nevada:

It lives up to the name.

Nevada:

It's one of Norway's national cakes, so you gotta try it.

Nevada:

Uh,

Bruce:

Nevada, you utilize a lot of flowers and buds in your baking.

Bruce:

Like you have dandelion, petal honey, short breads.

Bruce:

You have fireweed collar cookies and meadow sweet cheesecake.

Bruce:

Are these botanical ingredients readily available in Norway, or

Bruce:

do you need to forage for them?

Nevada:

We do need to forage for them, but having said that, they are.

Nevada:

Very much available all, all over the country.

Nevada:

In fact, for me, I just walk out my door and I have all these things growing.

Nevada:

Hmm.

Nevada:

So it's really lovely to be in the mountains and to just have that access.

Nevada:

And I think, you know, again, it's going back to the way nor the Norwegian food

Nevada:

culture always utilizes nature and how it always used these things before.

Nevada:

And I think sometimes that knowledge, you know, when you go to the grocery

Nevada:

store and you get used to that over time, that you kind of forget it.

Nevada:

But we're having that resurgence of going back.

Nevada:

And then, you know, learning what we have from nature, how we can use it.

Nevada:

But the ones I've listed in the book are for the most part available

Nevada:

around, I would say, the northern kind of parts of the world.

Nevada:

And anything else, we can find a substitute, but I hope people

Nevada:

will find the inspiration.

Nevada:

Yeah.

Nevada:

To look around their own backyards and see, you know, What's available?

Nevada:

What can they use?

Nevada:

How can they incorporate that in their baking?

Bruce:

I want to ask first, what is a Viking Pizza?

Bruce:

And talk about the toppings that you've combined and how you came up

Bruce:

with this incredible combination.

Nevada:

The Viking Pizza, it's kind of the nickname because Norwegians were making

Nevada:

their own variety of a pizza from a long, long time ago, and they would have made

Nevada:

it again with barley or rye flour, and it was flat and cooked over an open fire.

Nevada:

And they would've topped it with whatever was available.

Nevada:

So wild bird, eggs, fish cured meats, cheese, whatever during the time period.

Nevada:

And I kind of love that idea that because Norwegians love pizza.

Nevada:

In fact, I think it's the highest cons consumer of frozen pizzas in the world at

Nevada:

this point, which is an interesting fact.

Nevada:

So it's kind of a fun thing to utilize that, but then also

Nevada:

play on the history of it.

Nevada:

And so I wanted to make this kind of barley based pizza do.

Nevada:

And for me this summer, cuz this is in the summer chapter, is to highlight what's

Nevada:

what's coming out right now and all the beautiful local ingredients we have.

Nevada:

So we have these wild strawberries that are these tiny, you know, little

Nevada:

bursts of flavor, our local honey.

Nevada:

And then it has a semi aged goat cheese.

Nevada:

You know, we have wonderful, wonderful cheese and dairy products here, and then

Nevada:

cured pork, which again goes with us cured meats that we, we have a lot of here.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

So I just love the idea of putting them all together so you get that

Nevada:

sweet and savory first, and it's an homage to the history and the

Nevada:

present of our pizza culture.

Bruce:

Sour cherries show up in a few of your sweeter recipes.

Bruce:

In the book, you have sour cherry, crisp with almonds and seeds.

Bruce:

You have a farmhouse cheese and sour cherry tart that looks.

Bruce:

Amazing are sour cherry is very common in Norway.

Bruce:

And tell me about that tart and how you make that homemade cheese that goes in it.

Nevada:

We have a very little tiny sour tree, uh, sour,

Nevada:

sour cherry tree in our yard.

Nevada:

But I go to my neighbor who has quite a few, and I always

Nevada:

collect a few baskets from her.

Nevada:

Uh, and so.

Nevada:

We have, I love using them.

Nevada:

I think they're so much fun in the, in all different savory, sweet.

Nevada:

But this chart, this is a shortbread pastry, and then it has a very simple

Nevada:

compote with these, um, sour cherries.

Nevada:

And then I use the farmhouse cheese, which is basically the Kurds.

Nevada:

It's when you separate the kds in the way together, you get that.

Nevada:

Really smooth white, very mellow flavory cheese, well

Nevada:

cheese, essentially, I suppose.

Nevada:

Uh, very simple to do.

Nevada:

And so I like to put that on top of the compote and then cover that again

Nevada:

with the topping of the shortbread.

Nevada:

So you kind of get that sweet tangy burst of the, the sour cherries mixed

Nevada:

with that buttery shortbread pastry.

Nevada:

And then this mellow.

Nevada:

Cheese, you know, that doesn't carry much flavor.

Nevada:

So it all kind of adds that creaminess and, and loveliness to it.

Nevada:

So it's, it's one of those fun things to, to make in the summer.

Nevada:

Then invite friends over and just, you know, have a laugh in the garden.

Bruce:

If you had to choose one or two recipes from the book for

Bruce:

Americans to try, that would give them.

Bruce:

A taste of what you consider to be just quintessential Norway, what would that be?

Nevada:

Oh, that's a fantastic question because there's quite, well, obviously

Nevada:

the lea, I mean, that's the iconic nor, you know, baked good here in Norway and

Nevada:

I give a few variations in the book.

Bruce:

Can you explain what lefsa is?

Nevada:

So, lefsa is a soft flatbread.

Nevada:

It's either gonna be flower based or potato based with flour.

Nevada:

And it depends where you are in the country.

Nevada:

Everyone has their own recipe.

Nevada:

Every region has their own kind of version.

Nevada:

Everyone has their favorite.

Nevada:

And so in the, in the cookbook, I do, I do a few variations, but one does

Nevada:

come from our area in Norway, Puma, which is the medieval valley, and

Nevada:

it's, and ours is very, very thin.

Nevada:

So it's a very thin flower dairy base.

Nevada:

And then it has this like buttercream.

Nevada:

Filling, which is just butter and sugar.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And, and it's between two of these slices.

Nevada:

So they're super, super thin.

Nevada:

Really big.

Nevada:

Almost like a really large tortilla.

Nevada:

Mm-hmm.

Nevada:

And each bite just kind of like melts in your mouth.

Nevada:

And I think it's really important to have Lea so you can taste a bit

Nevada:

of Norway and understand how, as divided as cuz Norway, if you look at

Nevada:

the geography of it, it's divided by mountains and the sea and the fjords.

Nevada:

And you have all these pots of people all over, and yet they all

Nevada:

have, you know, the roots into lesa.

Nevada:

So that's a really, really important one, I would say.

Bruce:

Nevada Burg.

Bruce:

Thank you for creating this book, Norwegian Baking Through the Seasons.

Bruce:

We can find out more what you're doing@northwildkitchen.com.

Bruce:

Hey, thanks for spending some time with me this morning.

Nevada:

Thank you so much, Bruce.

Nevada:

This was so much fun.

Mark:

Check out Nevada Berg's website for her Norwegian lifestyle.

Mark:

It is really idyllic looking.

Mark:

I mean, it is a curated moment beyond all curated moments, but

Mark:

my gosh, we should all have more beauty like that in our lives.

Mark:

It's a fabulous thing.

Mark:

Some tape now are gonna actually go to, to Norway.

Mark:

I, I said to him, can't we, uh, Interview Nevada Berg in person in Norway.

Mark:

But, uh,

Bruce:

well, we could have,

Mark:

he seemed to think that was going in extra mile for the

Mark:

podcast, so we didn't do it.

Mark:

Before we get to what's making us happy in food this week, let

Mark:

me say that we have a newsletter.

Mark:

It just went out this last week and it's gonna go out again next week.

Mark:

You can sign up for our newsletter by going to our website.

Mark:

Bruce and mark.com.

Mark:

There you'll see a form.

Mark:

If you scroll down the page, you'll see a form.

Mark:

And I just wanna repeat, as I always do you that I have locked it so that I don't

Mark:

see your email, I don't see your name.

Mark:

I can't see anything about you, so I can't sell it and capture it.

Mark:

The service that I use cannot capture it and sell it, and you can always.

Mark:

Unsubscribe at any given moment.

Mark:

That is the best way to connect with us on a continuous basis.

Mark:

And, and then you'll have our email address as well.

Mark:

So what do you know?

Mark:

You'll be able to contact us whenever you want.

Mark:

Okay.

Mark:

Our last segment as is traditional.

Mark:

What's making us happy in food this week?

Bruce:

Pork rinds.

Bruce:

Oh my God.

Bruce:

I know it sounds disgusting.

Bruce:

I don't eat them like potato chips.

Bruce:

Holy gross.

Bruce:

What I do with them is I put them in the food processor with like barbecue spices

Bruce:

and grind them into a powder, and then I coat chicken breasts and pork chops and

Bruce:

other stuff in them and air fry them.

Bruce:

Then you get a crispy.

Bruce:

Carb free, crunchy, coded piece of protein, pork crunch.

Mark:

I, when I was a little kid, we, this is how old I am.

Mark:

We would go on vacation to Colorado, from Texas as Texans would, we

Mark:

would go on vacation to Colorado and I'm so old that car still had, you

Mark:

know, the bench seat in the front.

Mark:

Of the car.

Mark:

So my parents would be in the bench seat in the front of the car and they would

Mark:

have a bag of pork RINs between them.

Mark:

And mind you, my mother is still here at 90 and a half, so they were

Mark:

eating pork RINs in the front seat.

Mark:

And I have to tell you that as a kid, I found that smell nauseating.

Bruce:

Well, I still do when I cook with them.

Bruce:

Even opening that bag of fried pork RINs is a little nauseating, but.

Bruce:

Get them right in the food processor, dump in the barbecue spice, and then it's okay.

Bruce:

Yeah.

Bruce:

And they're really delicious as a coating.

Mark:

What's making me happy in food this week is something that

Mark:

I haven't even eaten yet, and that is a goat curry, which we're having

Mark:

tonight because it's freezing.

Mark:

Did you know that Bruce and I wrote the.

Mark:

Only all goat cookbook goat, meek milk cheese is, is out there on the market.

Mark:

And we, many years ago, went all in for goat.

Mark:

We still go all in for goat.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

We love goat and we're getting it.

Mark:

I'm getting a goat.

Mark:

Karina, I'm getting a vlu.

Mark:

Okay.

Mark:

I'm getting vlu if you don't know that.

Mark:

Uh, garlic and vinegar and chilis and, yeah.

Mark:

It's hard to talk about it.

Mark:

Right?

Mark:

Because it is allegedly Portuguese based, but now that's been questioned by the.

Mark:

Name may be the only part of it that actually comes from any

Mark:

Portuguese is vue, but a wine.

Mark:

And what?

Mark:

Wine and onion.

Mark:

Wine and garlic.

Mark:

And garlic.

Mark:

Like garlic and garlic and a little vinegar.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

And uh, the, you know, the name may be the only part that's

Mark:

really Portuguese about it.

Mark:

It's hard to know exactly.

Mark:

Now the origins of vue.

Mark:

But still, nonetheless it goes great with goat.

Mark:

I can tell you that much and I am looking forward to it tonight.

Mark:

That's our podcast This week we wanted to talk about baking and

Mark:

eating in and out of season and what to look for and enzyme tips on that.

Mark:

We hope you enjoyed being on the podcast with us.

Mark:

We certainly know that there are thousands of podcasts out there and your finding

Mark:

ours is a fine and fantastic thing.

Mark:

Thank you for doing that.

Mark:

There are a lot of choices.

Mark:

We appreciate you making our.

Mark:

Podcast yours.

Bruce:

If you have any tricks and tips or things that you like

Bruce:

to cook and eat in and out of season, share them with us please.

Bruce:

You can go to our Facebook group Cooking with Bruce and Mark and you can share

Bruce:

them there and see videos and recipes, and we always have, uh, questions and

Bruce:

lots of discussion going on about food.

Bruce:

So go to cooking with Bruce and Mark on Facebook and come back here for another

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About the Podcast

Cooking with Bruce and Mark
Fantastic recipes, culinary science, a little judgment, hysterical banter, love and laughs--you know, life.
Join us, Bruce Weinstein and Mark Scarbrough, for weekly episodes all about food, cooking, recipes, and maybe a little marital strife on air. After writing thirty-six cookbooks, we've got countless opinions and ideas on ingredients, recipes, the nature of the cookbook-writing business, and much more. If you've got a passion for food, we also hope to up your game once and a while and to make you laugh most of the time. Come along for the ride! There's plenty of room!

About your host

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Mark Scarbrough

Former lit professor, current cookbook writer, creator of two podcasts, writer of thirty-five (and counting) cookbooks, author of one memoir (coming soon!), married to a chef (my cookbook co-writer, Bruce Weinstein), and with him, the owner of two collies, all in a very rural spot in New England. My life's full and I'm up for more challenges!